Wikidebates - User contributions [en]

Power to citizen

2025-04-13T18:45:41Z

Armelp: Created page with "{{Argument |displayed-title=Power to citizen |summary=We need to distinguish between upstream quotas (consumers) and downstream quotas (producers). They can be complementary...."

{{Argument
|displayed-title=Power to citizen
|summary=We need to distinguish between upstream quotas (consumers) and downstream quotas (producers). They can be complementary. The advantage of upstream quotas for consumers (which cannot be defrauded) is that they give consumers the power to choose how they travel and consume. For citizen, it's important to sign on https://eci.ec.europa.eu/051/public to push the European Commission to organise democratic assemblies for climatic action.
|sections=Economy
|keywords=climate
}}

Air Quotas work better than the alternative solution of capping traffic (at EU, national or airport level)

2025-04-13T18:43:03Z

Armelp: /* Justifications */ Added existing argument

{{Argument
|displayed-title=The alternative solution to Air Quotas of capping traffic (at EU, national or airport level) has many cons
|summary=Capping individual flights works better than capping traffic, because restricted supply drives up prices and eventually leads to the same situation as taxes.

In the EU, aviation CO2 emissions are capped through the ETS (European Trading Scheme), a cap-and-trade system, and the number of movements is capped at some airports.
|justifications={{Justification
|page=Power to citizen
|displayed-title=Power to citizen
}}
|sections=Ecology, Economy
|keywords=aviation, climate
}}

Economic theory

2025-04-13T18:41:20Z

Armelp: Created page with "{{Argument |displayed-title=Economic theory |summary=The economic theory of the tax is based on the price signal, which is supposed to reduce purchases when the price rises. I..."

{{Argument
|displayed-title=Economic theory
|summary=The economic theory of the tax is based on the price signal, which is supposed to reduce purchases when the price rises. In fact, it is only effective for individuals with a constrained budget. Most carbon emissions and flight abuse are caused by the ultrarich people with unconstrained budgets: taxes have no reductive effect.
|sections=Economy
|keywords=Economy
}}

Air Quotas are more effective than the alternative solution ‘Control through prices’ (taxes)

2025-04-13T18:39:37Z

Armelp: /* Justifications */ Added existing argument

{{Argument
|displayed-title=The alternative solution ‘Control through prices’ (taxes) is not effective
|summary=Air Quotas would be more effective than taxes to reduce air traffic because control trough prices don't work well with the richest who fly most.
|justifications={{Justification
|page=Economic theory
|displayed-title=Economic theory
}}
|objections={{Objection
|page=Taxes can be effective in reducing air traffic if they are high enough
|displayed-title=Taxes can be effective if they are high enough
}}{{Objection
|page=A carbon tax with redistribution would be as effective but much simpler than Air Quotas
|displayed-title=A carbon fee and dividend would be as effective and much simpler
}}
|sections=Ecology, Economy
|keywords=aviation, climate
}}

Freedom

2025-04-13T18:37:38Z

Armelp: Created page with "{{Argument |displayed-title=Freedom |summary=In a mechanism that includes all purchases, everyone has the freedom to choose. |sections=Economy |keywords=climate }}"

{{Argument
|displayed-title=Freedom
|summary=In a mechanism that includes all purchases, everyone has the freedom to choose.
|sections=Economy
|keywords=climate
}}

The Air Quotas system could be extended to all carbon products and services

2025-04-13T18:36:29Z

Armelp: /* Justifications */ Added existing argument

{{Argument
|displayed-title=The Air Quotas system can easily be extended to all carbon products and services
|summary=Air Quotas would be a first trial of a wider system applicable to all carbon goods and services called carbon account (in French, Compte carbone). It would be designed to make its extension as easy as possible.
|justifications={{Justification
|page=Freedom
|displayed-title=Freedom
}}
|sections=Ecology, Economy
|keywords=aviation, climate
}}

Keeping a close eye

2025-04-13T18:34:43Z

Armelp: Created page with "{{Argument |displayed-title=Keeping a close eye |summary=Buyers are no longer comparing price alone, but carbon labelling as well, and keeping a close eye on it as they will b..."

{{Argument
|displayed-title=Keeping a close eye
|summary=Buyers are no longer comparing price alone, but carbon labelling as well, and keeping a close eye on it as they will be limited.
|sections=Economy
|keywords=climate
}}

Air Quotas develop environmental awareness

2025-04-13T18:33:52Z

Armelp: /* Justifications */ Added existing argument

{{Argument
|displayed-title=Air Quotas develop environmental awareness
|summary=As the system assumes that the carbon content of flights is calculated and displayed, consumers will be able to make informed choices.
|justifications={{Justification
|page=keeping a close eye
|displayed-title=keeping a close eye
}}
|sections=Ecology, Economy
|keywords=aviation, climate
}}

Decided by the people

2025-04-13T07:00:55Z

Armelp: Created page with "{{Argument |displayed-title=Decided by the people |summary=The strength of the requested national vote is that once a majority has been reached, politicians will no longer be..."

{{Argument
|displayed-title=Decided by the people
|summary=The strength of the requested national vote is that once a majority has been reached, politicians will no longer be able to change what has been decided by the people.
|sections=Economy, Society
|keywords=climate, democracy
}}

Lawmakers may set poor "mechanism details" initially or later

2025-04-13T06:59:59Z

Armelp: /* Objections */ Added existing argument

{{Argument
|displayed-title=Lawmakers may set poor "mechanism details" initially or later
|initialisation=Con argument@1614
|summary=Proponents of the mechanism propose what they consider to be an ideal initial carbon allowance and ideal annual percentage rate of reduction for the allowance. Adverse changes to those numbers may be made by lawmakers in establishing the law. In subsequent years, lawmakers may relax the requirements to accommodate backlash from flyers and the industry. A hollow mechanism could be the outcome, due to the nature of the mechanism and political opportunity to manipulate it.
|objections={{Objection
|page=Decided by the people
|displayed-title=Decided by the people
}}
}}

Can only be bought through authorized agency

2025-04-13T06:45:56Z

Armelp: Created page with "{{Argument |displayed-title=Can only be bought through authorized agency |summary=As allowances can only be bought and sold through the authorized agency, unidentified carbon..."

{{Argument
|displayed-title=Can only be bought through authorized agency
|summary=As allowances can only be bought and sold through the authorized agency, unidentified carbon points cannot be used.
|sections=Economy
|keywords=climate
}}

Prone to fraud

2025-04-13T06:45:04Z

Armelp: /* Objections */ Renamed argument

{{Argument
|displayed-title=Prone to fraud
|initialisation=Con argument@1614
|objections={{Objection
|page=Can only be bought through authorized agency
|displayed-title=Can only be bought through authorized agency
}}
|sections=Ecology, Economy
}}

Only bought officially

2025-04-13T06:34:51Z

Armelp: Created page with "{{Argument |displayed-title=Only bought officially |summary=As allowances can only be bought and sold through the official agency, unidentified carbon points cannot be used. |..."

{{Argument
|displayed-title=Only bought officially
|summary=As allowances can only be bought and sold through the official agency, unidentified carbon points cannot be used.
|sections=Economy
|keywords=climate
}}

Prone to fraud

2025-04-13T06:30:50Z

Armelp: /* Objections */ Added existing argument

{{Argument
|displayed-title=Prone to fraud
|initialisation=Con argument@1614
|objections={{Objection
|page=Only bought officially
|displayed-title=Only bought officially
}}
|sections=Ecology, Economy
}}

Modeling

2025-04-12T17:07:41Z

Armelp:

{{Argument
|displayed-title=Modeling
|initialisation=Objection@1643
|summary=Modelling shows that the price of surpluses could double every year, given scarcity (minus 6%) and the fact that many excess citizens won't want to sell their surpluses to help the rich.
|sections=Economy
|keywords=climate
}}

Modeling

2025-04-11T15:55:07Z

Armelp: Created page with "{{Argument |displayed-title=Modeling |initialisation=Objection@1643 |summary=Modeling shows that the price of surpluses could double every year, given scarcity (minus 6%) and..."

{{Argument
|displayed-title=Modeling
|initialisation=Objection@1643
|summary=Modeling shows that the price of surpluses could double every year, given scarcity (minus 6%) and the fact that many excess citizens won't want to sell their surpluses to help the rich.
|sections=Economy
|keywords=climate
}}

500 carbon points

2025-04-11T15:50:49Z

Armelp: Created page with "{{Argument |displayed-title=500 carbon points |initialisation=Objection@1638 |summary=Any citizen get 500 carbon points Ͼ for first year, it's enough for Paris-Athens-Paris o..."

{{Argument
|displayed-title=500 carbon points
|initialisation=Objection@1638
|summary=Any citizen get 500 carbon points Ͼ for first year, it's enough for Paris-Athens-Paris or Roma-Stockholm-Roma. Those who want to travel more by flight can buy surpluses, more and more expensive but not forbidden.
|sections=Economy
}}

Share the sky

2025-04-10T21:12:56Z

Armelp: Created page with "{{Argument |displayed-title=Share the sky |initialisation=Justification@1621 |summary=The abuse of air travel is considered unfair by those who do not have the resources or th..."

{{Argument
|displayed-title=Share the sky
|initialisation=Justification@1621
|summary=The abuse of air travel is considered unfair by those who do not have the resources or the needs: the volume can be reduced by sharing the right to the sky with everyone, which brings recognition and rewards to those who do not use air travel (between 70 and 80% of Europeans).
|sections=Economy
|keywords=Climate, disparities
}}

83% less in 30 years

2025-04-10T21:01:06Z

Armelp: Created page with "{{Argument |displayed-title=83% less in 30 years |initialisation=Justification@1620 |summary=The 6% annual reduction in carbon money ensures that airlines can only use as much..."

{{Argument
|displayed-title=83% less in 30 years
|initialisation=Justification@1620
|summary=The 6% annual reduction in carbon money ensures that airlines can only use as much carbon as they need to keep the planet in balance: 6% less each year, equivalent to 83% less in 30 years.
|bibliography={{Bibliographical reference
|authors=Alain Trannoy, Pierre-Henri Bono
|work=Revue d'économie politique
|volume=2024-4
|location=page 553
|place=Paris
|date=09/09/2024
|link=https://shs.cairn.info/journal-revue-d-economie-politique-2024-4-page-553?tab=resume
}}
|sections=Economy
|keywords=climate
}}

Forbidden to buy directly

2025-04-10T20:49:09Z

Armelp: Created page with "{{Argument |displayed-title=Forbidden to buy directly |initialisation=Justification@1619 |summary=To avoid abuse of authority, it would be impossible to buy directly: surpluse..."

{{Argument
|displayed-title=Forbidden to buy directly
|initialisation=Justification@1619
|summary=To avoid abuse of authority, it would be impossible to buy directly: surpluses would have to be obtained solely from the carbon agency, which would regulate trading by raising the price in line with demand.
}}

Forbiden to buy directly

2025-04-10T09:10:36Z

Armelp: Created page with "{{Argument |displayed-title=Forbiden to buy directly |initialisation=Justification@1619 |summary=To avoid abuse of authority, it would be impossible to buy directly: surpluses..."

{{Argument
|displayed-title=Forbiden to buy directly
|initialisation=Justification@1619
|summary=To avoid abuse of authority, it would be impossible to buy directly: surpluses would have to be obtained solely from the carbon agency, which would regulate trading by raising the price in line with demand.
}}

6% per year

2025-04-10T09:05:30Z

Armelp: Created page with "{{Argument |displayed-title=6% per year |initialisation=Justification@1620 |summary=The 6% annual reduction in the carbon money distributed to Europeans ensures that airlines..."

{{Argument
|displayed-title=6% per year
|initialisation=Justification@1620
|summary=The 6% annual reduction in the carbon money distributed to Europeans ensures that airlines cannot exceed this constantly shrinking volume.
}}

The 6% annual reduction in the carbon money distributed to Europeans ensures that airlines cannot exceed this constantly shrinking volume

2025-04-10T08:55:25Z

Armelp: Created page with "{{Argument |displayed-title=The 6% annual reduction in the carbon money distributed to Europeans ensures that airlines cannot exceed this constantly shrinking volume. |initial..."

{{Argument
|displayed-title=The 6% annual reduction in the carbon money distributed to Europeans ensures that airlines cannot exceed this constantly shrinking volume.
|initialisation=Justification@1620
}}